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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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Currently just finished 3rd year at UW Arts (Sociology) and Business. Switched after first year from UofT Management program. I noticed a lot of UW engineers but no one from arts so if you have any questions ask away!
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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Respects wrote:How are the coop jobs for arts students? How hard is it to maintain a high GPA to go to graduate school? How is the social life? I also applied to York, Mac and Ryerson. How would you compare the arts & business program to these unis for social sciences(other than the coop). Hi Respects! Great questions. Before I answer them first I am not sober so if my answers are not coherent I apologize ;) Second, do remember these are not facts and just my own ideas. How are the co op jobs for arts students? To be fair they are not amazing. Waterloo is known for engineering and computer science. The arts faculty is underfunded and not a major priority to UW. UW will post roughly 1200 to 1500 jobs per co-op cycle for students. Of those jobs about about 100 to 150 will be open to all arts students. Then,another 100 to 200 for arts and business. Finally, about 10 to 30 jobs for your specific major. Some of these jobs are terrible (administrative boring crap) and some are amazing. The amazing jobs are competitive and will have anywhere from 50 to 100 people applying per position. Co-op is not all what the school makes it out to be especially for the arts. If you are looking for government work you will most likely doing a lot of jobs in Ottawa which can make life hard. If you want more detail on co-op let me know and I will write out a pros/cons for you. How hard is it to maintain a high GPA for graduate school? It really depends on what you mean by high. At UOFT I was at a 3.5X and was considered top 20% that year. At Waterloo I am at a 3.4x and probably considered a 15% top student (engineering GPA's are much lower). University is not difficult if you learn to manage your time and put even a little work. What graduate school do you have in mind? How is the social life? This where things get pretty subjective. I am fortunate in that I was at UofT for a year and also did a student exchange at the University of Hong Kong. I also have friends from a lot of different universities. Waterloo is where fun goes to die! No, I am just kidding. There is a decent social scene like all universities but you have to realize it is an engineering school with a lot of introverts and people who study all day. If you are into the 'nerdy' things and campus clubs then you will have fun. If you are into a lot of partying like queens or western you will not find that here. How would I compare arts and business to other social sciences? As you can already tell I am not the biggest fan of arts and business. IMO it is a relatively weak program compared to other schools. Legal studies is not a strong program here and is fairly new. I have taken a fair bit of your required courses and was not impressed. The business side is a little misleading. The courses are not in depth enough to be of any real use. Take a look at the business side course requirements and you will see some filler course requirements such as one language course or one course on the history of business. It is hard to compare to other universities but if I could pick for social sciences I know for sure UBC and UofT have strong social science departments. I really know nothing about york, mac or rye sorry! What are your future plans? Please ask away if you anymore questions :)
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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Respects, I too am planning to go to law school within a few years. The arts in general do not have the best career prospects when compared to some other majors. On top of that government jobs are quite frankly poor paying compared to their private counterparts. If you like the environments at york or mac better then I would lean towards those schools. In my opinion the environment you are is very important to doing well in school. I insist you visit waterloo. It is a small and quiet university city. You cannot compare it to Toronto in terms of the environment. For me Toronto is on a whole other level. If you stick with government jobs do prepare to travel to the ottawa-gatineau region a lot. Here is a shot I took of some of the poli sci jobs listed for the winter semester. http://img138.imageshack.us/i/uwpolisci.png/
The salary ranges can vary greatly. Some people will volunteer and make nothing and some people will make $28.00/hour. It depends entirely on you. You will find the average salaries by faculty here: http://www.jobmine.uwaterloo.ca/students/
Do keep in mind accounting and finance skew the arts salaries upwards. Most government jobs have strict pay ranges according to how many co-op terms you have finished, your past experiences etc. Starting will generally be about 14.00 to 16.00/hr and will move up to between 18.00 and 20.00. It is hard for me to compare reputations because it is not something I take a look at. To be honest york and ryerson have pretty bad reputations amongst university students. If it is true or not I do not know, but they are generally not seen as the same standards as say uoft or mcgill. I am curious why you did not apply to these universities? All in all do not worry too much. If you are not in co-op it is not like you are barred from applying to jobs. Also, probably just under half of everyone who enters university switches their major. Just keep your marks up and you will keep a lot of doors open! Hope that answers your questions! :)
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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I am not sure what you mean by not make it? I assume you mean make it to law school. UofT does mark harder than waterloo or a lot of other universities. The problem is that some of those schools have a lower quality of teaching. Take Waterloo for example, the grading is easier but the quality of teaching is worse. This has negative consequences on your motivation. I do not want to pay attention in class when the prof does not know how to teach, the TA does not speak english, the test is poorly constructed and so on. They seem to cancel each other out. My grades took a small dip when i transfered to waterloo and also a small dip when I went to the university of hong kong. Mac I would have to say does have the better social scene. Of course you can get a job with a BA. Do not think that a BA is any less valuable than engineering or bcomm. If you have a degree in history or political science you have your work cut out for you. In the end of the day it comes down to the individual and not the degree. All social science are near equal in terms of undergraduate incomes. As for grad school that is where you begin to see real differences. International development and international relations tend to be multidisciplinary. There tends to be no traditional career path after graduation. For example BMO does not have a international developer position. It seems like you are unsure as to what you want to do. Do not worry! If you do not like your program or school after first year you can always switch!
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 3/9/2011
Posts: 8
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What kinds of things do you wish you knew about univeristy before going? Is there anything you didn't bring with you that you wish you'd had in your first year?
It's really nice of you to make this thread, by the way. :)
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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Hi Ranta! Thanks I do enjoy helping people. Its hard to get advice since the university has its own agendas and some highschool students often have no clue as to what they are talking about ;) What kind of things do I wish I knew? I wish I knew how many things there are to do. Everything from volunteering in africa to build wells to doing research for your professor. There are so many things to do after your undergraduate it is careful not to close any doors. Also, your grades are important if you want to get a very competitive job or graduate program. First year is hard due to the adjustment but the actual work is very easy and it is a good oppurtunity to get high grades. It will hit you like a brickwall when your friend with a 3.85 GPA gets a consulting job with $80,000 starting salary and you didnt even get an interview! Bring with my physically? I am actually a real nomad. I literally do not own anything except for some clothes and a laptop. The laptop is convenient but you actually do not even need it for school as you get to use the computers in the library or computer labs (you will need the clothes though...). I will add I wish had some weights and a pullup bar when I first moved to waterloo. Even if your too lazy to go to the gym/run atleast you can do something at home!
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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You are going to have to be a little more specific by facilities/resources. Psychology, anthropology and sociology are all found in one building (a nightmare if you are looking for a specific room). There are a few computer labs and a lounge in the building. I know sociology has a student club but they are inactive. I do not know the situation with the other clubs. There are sports clubs for everything you want to play. The gym is quite small but it still does the trick. Engineering and science students make up the bulk of the student population I would imagine so they get the most resources. I have to add as a side note you can take a few courses at laurier which is a nice change!
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 3/6/2011
Posts: 19
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It sounds like you don't feel the "business" aspect really helped. ;\ Which was the only reason why I applied to Loo. I thought it would give me a comprehensive education on both my major and in business.
I have a few questions -
1.Do you regret transfering to Waterloo? I feel like, the other faculties are overshadowded by Engineering.
2. If you chose to specialize in something, how does your degree come out?
3.In terms of social life, are there some parties at Loo? Or do people go down the street to Laurier.
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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Hi Inspirative, Great questions! Will arts and business give you a comprehensive education in business? Hard to say, especially since I have not finished all the requirements. More importantly they have changed the requirements and added new ones for your incoming class. The new classes actually look like they might have some use! Lets take a closer look though: the course requirements for the business side found here: http://ugradcalendar.uwa...iness-Co-op-and-Regular
If you actually look at the course you will notice some are pretty useless and are just filler. one of HIST 113, 243; PSCI 231 Second Language (one course) ARTS 280 (stats) History of business is not really useful. The PSCI on government and business might be interesting but not really useful for business. The second language course? This is equivilant to a grade 11 or 12 language course =\ Arts 280 or stats is something you will take for any arts major. Now lets look at the actual arts and business (ARBUS) courses. ARBUS 101 was a terrible class. I can say this somewhat objectively because the course used the same textbook and material as my management class at UofT. The differences in quality of these two courses was quite a bit. A bit of this is to blame on the actual professor and a bit on the actual curriculum. ARBUS 200 Entrepreneurship though interesting at times is quite a bad course as well. A lot of stories and BS by the professor. ARBUS 202 Ethics has more than one professor and I unknowingly took it with the wrong one. Again, some interesting topics covered here and there but not actually useful for business. ARBUS 102 accounting if you have not taken high school accounting might be the most useful. In the end it looks like we are left with just 3 or 4 of the 14 course requirements having any real value. 1. Do I regret transferring to Waterloo? Somewhat! UofT has its own set of unique problems RE: snobs and no financial aid. UW arts and business has a lot of kinks that it is going to have to iron out. The business side is not comparable to a proper business program say rotmans or ivey. 2. You have to be a little more specific as to specialize? If you mean the HRM or global engagement specialization within arts and business I have no idea. Arts and business will give you a BA degree regardless of your major. 3. Sure there are parties. This is something you find in all universities. Now how often and how big is going to change from school to school. Waterloo is probably not comparable to say queens or western. But if you want to get piss drunk everyday you will find people to do that with. If you want to just go to the bar on friday/saturday you will find people for that too. If you want to have harry potter parade sunday morning you will find people for that too! To some extent it really depends on you and your personality :) Can I ask what schools/programs you have applied to?
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 3/6/2011
Posts: 19
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I really appreciate you taking your time to answer these questions. :)
I've applied to Enviro&Business and Fine Arts & Business. The only reason why I'd consider going to Loo for Fine Arts or any program is because of the business aspect, I feel like since business is an aspect of all fields - it would allow me to sell myself better, especially in a major like Fine Arts.
When I went for a campus visit, it was clear that the focus was on Engineering. But I did see the new Enviro building. Overall I was pretty dissapointed with the campus compared to others I've visited. But it's not about that, I just want a good education to get into grad school or a nice paying job.
From your retells, it sounds like Waterloo doesn't really provide that education it brags about in its brochures. :(
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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Pleasures all mine inspirative! Fine arts and business are worlds apart. I have read about one person who I think was in fine arts and business co-op do well. She did a lot of work terms for design companies etc. You have to realize it is a very atypical major to try get an office job with. Will the business degree help you sell yourself? Yes, I think somewhat. If you look at my previous post you have to go into some depth to realize the business side is all fluff. The good thing is that employers really won't know this. Obviously you are not on par with someone who has a bcomm or bba but still I think some entry level office jobs will be open to you by the business name. Do not take my word on it though, I have not graduated nor have I started looking for full-time work! I'll regurgitate a common theme in this thread; if you want to do well in arts you will most likely end up going to grad school at some point. If I recall correctly something like 46% of those at UW arts end up going to grad school. For now do not worry too much about it. If you do not like the business side of a program you can drop it. If you do not like fine arts you can switch to environment. If you do not like waterloo you can switch to another school granted you have the grades. Nothing is set in stone. Unfortunately I am not familiar with the environment faculty so I cannot comment. I am sure if you contact the environment faculty they may have student leaders or ambassadors you can answer your questions! As for the education it brags about in the brochures, this is no way unique to waterloo. All universities exaggerate the truth. Even though they are public institutions at the end of the day they are all competing for students. They will do whatever it takes bring in the monies! It is important to adjust your expectations of university as it is not always all gumdrops and lollipops as some schools would make you think!
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 2/8/2011
Posts: 8
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Hello, I got in for Arts and Business CO-OP, and I am planning on majoring in English and French, plus completing the required credits for International Trade/Human Resources Management. I hear some really good things about the program from some, but a lot of other people advise me not to go there because the CO-OP sucks. Is it true that I will end up getting a job that pays minimum wage, - or no job at all? I want to use the 2 years of work experience that I will/may acquire to go on to Schulich right after graduation. What would you advise me? Thanks. 
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 5/23/2011
Posts: 2
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WOOWW you are such a nice person!!!!! i recently got an offer from uw arts(psychology) and business coop, so my question will be is it hard to find a job in coop program in your second year? What will be the employment rate be? And i also want to study accounting in the university, so can i apply for double major?
thx
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 3/20/2011
Posts: 5
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AgriGen,
thank you very much for all of your help, it's been much better than that of those who probably were sober :D
Would you say your experience at Waterloo has been positive? If the business side of classes were rather fluffy, what made you stay in the program? Why did you leave U of T?
What is the city of Waterloo like? I really like TO as a city, and would be a bit disappointed if Waterloo was the same size, or smaller than my hometown. I like to think that maybe Waterloo would be less distracting, and I could visit TO on weekends if I needed to.
Would it be better to go to U of T for Arts & Science as opposed to trying out the ARBUS coop at Waterloo?
What is your residence experience? Do you think that the price of being at Waterloo is worth it?
Did you do any specializations, interdisciplinary programs, or options?
What is the environment faculty? (environmental sciences?) Do you know anything about the Knowledge Integration program?
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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Jesus! I have written a very lengthy response twice and twice it has been erased! Who designed this website?! Anyways, here is the shortened version of my answer - sorry guys its 3:30 AM! Maddex, The areas of study you propose are tradtionaly ones where it might be more difficult to find a job. Arts is simply not UWs strong suit. I have been happy with the money I have made from co-op. Below you will find the stats on co-op earnings. http://www.cecs.uwaterloo.ca/students/salary.php As for employment rates.. they have gotten rid of the numbers for some reason but they were usually between 65% to 80% for co-op students. What year you are in and what area of study will change that number. Why do you want to go to schulich? Why your current choice of study? Why not a business program now? Also, I know a lot of business schools do not count co-op/internships as work experience! Might want to check that. 1234aww, Thanks I do try my best to help! The above response answers your first questions. As for accounting you should call the school and ask. Accounting at waterloo can be competitive so I double check to see if they will actually allow it. elia, Your welcome! Waterloo has been fairly positive. I stayed in the program because I am fairly far into my degree; no point in switching to just sociology. I left uoft for a few reasons... number one simply an excuse to move out of the house.. another one was to do co-op... and it sounds bad but I found some people at uoft to be.... snobby douches :p A lot of waterloo life revolves around the universities and tech companies. It is small in comparison to Toronto but there are a lot of different things to do. For example.. we have scuba diving classes at school that I wish I knew about earlier! I really do not know anything about uoft arts and science sorry! It is tiring but something I suggest people do is come up with some questions and call admissions. Ask them what the employment prospects were.. questions about courses... program switching.. etc! I never stayed at residence at waterloo. Everyone says its a great experience... I have never heard anyone say they did not like residence and thats for every university. Is it worth the price... that really depends on you but for most people probably yes! My degree is arts (honors sociology) and business (equivalent to a minor probably). Again I do not know anything about environment sorry! :( I did take a course there called GIS information systems which I would of enjoyed if not for some very poor TAs! Again, I would go look at the required courses and call admissions for any questions. I did know about the KI program until you mentioned it sorry! Hope I answered everyones questions! Will drop by from time to time if anyone else has more questions! :) Agrigen
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 1/22/2012
Posts: 1
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Hey
I'm a current student at york university in visual arts. My program is pretty top notch, but I dont think I fit at York. I dont think its the place for me or a place where i can create meaningful art. I was accepted to arts and business co-op last year and am planning to re-apply this year. In a way i really regret rejecting the program; i thought i wouldnt be able to handle the business courses but i think i was just feeling lazy. Anyways, I want to travel and dont want to be in TOO much debt by the end of the four years. In your opinion and experience, should i seriously consider a transfer?
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 6/3/2011
Posts: 80
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inspirative wrote:I really appreciate you taking your time to answer these questions. :)
I've applied to Enviro&Business and Fine Arts & Business. The only reason why I'd consider going to Loo for Fine Arts or any program is because of the business aspect, I feel like since business is an aspect of all fields - it would allow me to sell myself better, especially in a major like Fine Arts.
When I went for a campus visit, it was clear that the focus was on Engineering. But I did see the new Enviro building. Overall I was pretty dissapointed with the campus compared to others I've visited. But it's not about that, I just want a good education to get into grad school or a nice paying job.
From your retells, it sounds like Waterloo doesn't really provide that education it brags about in its brochures. :( I know this was posted back in March, but I hope you're still browsing these forums because I'm actually in Fine Arts. :) I applied for Arts & Business in the beginning, and while I did not like it and eventually dropped the program for just Fine Arts, the two together work much much better. The thing with Fine Arts is that there is NO option for co-op UNLESS you are in Arts & Business. This is a serious advantage. There are plenty of companies that need graphic designers and other Fine Arts related jobs. All of the people I know in Arts & Business and Fine Arts have had great co-op jobs. ALSO: Arts & Business and Fine Arts allows for the Digital Arts Communication specialization, something NOT offered without Arts & Business (much to my disappointment). These courses are definitely useful and are fantastic if you have the opportunity to take them. SO in conclusion, they may be "worlds apart" but at Waterloo, they compliment each other and allow for new opportunities that you would not get without the combination. I definitely recommend it. While the business program admittedly isn't as great as other schools, if you're looking into Fine Arts this could be worth it for you. robingberg wrote:Hey
I'm a current student at york university in visual arts. My program is pretty top notch, but I dont think I fit at York. I dont think its the place for me or a place where i can create meaningful art. I was accepted to arts and business co-op last year and am planning to re-apply this year. In a way i really regret rejecting the program; i thought i wouldnt be able to handle the business courses but i think i was just feeling lazy. Anyways, I want to travel and dont want to be in TOO much debt by the end of the four years. In your opinion and experience, should i seriously consider a transfer? My answer above may also come in handy for you. If you plan on sticking with Visual Arts and want to get into Arts & Business, the combo at Waterloo could be worth it. Also, with the co-op option you probably won't be in as much debt as you think. Arts programs are much cheaper than other programs offered at Waterloo. You will likely be able to handle the business as they aren't truly business courses. Most of the 'business' courses already exist somewhere in other Arts majors and are cross-listed with the Arts & Business title and business is slapped on. I found that only Accounting was useful to me (but I was only in Arts & Business for a year). 4A University of Waterloo
Honours Fine Arts Studio 2013
Front Desk Assistant - Residence/Housing
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Rank: Senior Student
Joined: 3/14/2011
Posts: 132
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robingberg wrote:Hey
I'm a current student at york university in visual arts. My program is pretty top notch, but I dont think I fit at York. I dont think its the place for me or a place where i can create meaningful art. I was accepted to arts and business co-op last year and am planning to re-apply this year. In a way i really regret rejecting the program; i thought i wouldnt be able to handle the business courses but i think i was just feeling lazy. Anyways, I want to travel and dont want to be in TOO much debt by the end of the four years. In your opinion and experience, should i seriously consider a transfer? Hmm I really hate the design of this website. Hopefully this post is still relevant. I am sorry but I don't know anything about visual arts. How many courses will successfully transfer for you? I transferred from UofT 1st year and had all my courses count. I did not lose any time. The business courses are fairly easy... maybe even too easy? Here is the important part.. what do you want to do after you graduate? If you are sure you just want to get a job and be done with school. Pick the school that gives you the best employment opportunities. Do you know what industry/companies you would like to work for? Send them emails ask if they recruit at york and/or waterloo? If yes, how do they recruit? Is it simply a job posting? On campus recruiting (OCR, the best type of recruiting as the company is dedicating a lot of time and effort to find talent - good sign)? Even better give them a call and try and speak with HR. Speak with the school administrations as well, ask them who recruits. How many people went into so and so company or industry last year? Hope that helps.
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 5/12/2012
Posts: 4
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Hello!
I applied to York University (Law and Society), University of Toronto (Ethics, Society, and Law), and University of Waterloo (Arts and Business co-op - Legal studies).
Right now, I'm debating against Toronto or Waterloo, but I'm open to York as well.
Which program would you recommend if I wanted to pursue a career in law in the future (Osgoode graduate school)?
While I want to experience campus life at Waterloo, Toronto and York is close to home and very convenient ...
Help?
Thank you!
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Rank: Frosh
Joined: 10/15/2011
Posts: 13
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Hi!
I read one of your replies, and you said that there was about 150 co-op spots for arts?
Do you mean that there are only 150 for the entire department?
Doesnt one program itself avg about 100 students?
Cause for the Planning program itself they accept 100 applicants a year, so is finding a co-op job that hard?
What are the chances of you not finding a co-op job?
Thanks!
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